Substitute for PB for Diabetics?

Posted on: Sat, 03/29/2003 - 3:54am
Anonymous's picture
Anonymous (not verified)

Katiee raised this very good question in a separate thread:-

If "peanut butter" is vital in schools for diabetic children could
someone (God help me! ) explain the "medical reasons" why?

I'm asking this because if it has to do with glucose or protein or
something why not used soy nut butter or something similar as a
substitute?

McKenzie's Mom posted this to answer Katiee:-

I'm really puzzled about the peanut butter quick fix for a diabetic
reaction. I have two nephews who have Type I diabetes and here is
the list their mother gave me that the Canadian Diabetes Assn
recommends for reactions"

2 or 3 glucose tablets
1/2 cup (4 ounces) of any fruit juice
1/2 cup (4 ounces) of a regular (not diet) soft drink
1 cup (8 ounces) of milk
5 or 6 pieces of hard candy
1 or 2 teaspoons of sugar or honey

Their mother also has used sweet pickles or jam in an emergency.
She has never used PB and has never heard of anyone who has. It
may be an alternative source, but it's obviously not the BEST choice
for a reaction.

Corvallis Mom also provided an explanation.

The thread where this discussion is going on has nothing to do with diabetes, it kinda veered off topic.

However, I thought (IMHO) that Katiee actually raised an excellent question. What happens should our PA children one day become diabetic?

I will use the analogy that I used in the other thread. If you look at the Safe Snack and Lunch List posted on this board, you will see alternatives provided for pb that offer the same amount of protein or more than pb does. This helps a parent, when wanting to provide their child with protein (in this case it was for school lunches and snacks where one is presented with a peanut free classroom and I guess basically for us PA parents ourselves) see that there are many alternatives to pb out there for them and their children to choose from that do provide equal amounts of protein or even more protein than pb. Pb is not the be all and end all of protein requirements (think of all of us who remember if you wouldn't/couldn't eat your dinner and your parents thought that if they gave you a pb sandwich before bed, you were at least getting something *good* into you - not my parents because I've always hated pb, but you know the story. And how we, as PA parents have to find alternatives when faced with picky eater children that will not or can not eat their dinners and yet we want to make sure that they have something *good* in their stomachs before heading off to bed - separate from the bed-time snack thing).

Soy butter and sunflower butter have been suggested as possible alternatives.

I'm interested in an answer to Katiee's original question. [img]http://uumor.pair.com/nutalle2/peanutallergy/smile.gif[/img]

Many thanks and best wishes! [img]http://uumor.pair.com/nutalle2/peanutallergy/smile.gif[/img]

[This message has been edited by Cindy Spowart Cook (edited March 29, 2003).]

Posted on: Sat, 03/29/2003 - 1:50pm
MommaBear's picture
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Joined: 09/23/2002 - 09:00

Cindy,
Here are some interesting links.
[url="http://www.foundation.csus.edu/dining/calendar/whatscooking.html"]http://www.foundation.csus.edu/dining/calendar/whatscooking.html[/url]
(in the link you will find a "box" entitled "food for thought" and a subheading of [b] "Peanut Butter and Diabetes" [/b] ) towards the middle of the article.
******************
[url="http://www.diabetes.org/main/type1/parents_kids/away/scrights.jsp"]http://www.diabetes.org/main/type1/parents_kids/away/scrights.jsp[/url]
Link discussing issues such as Diabetes, Americans With Disabilities Act, Section 504, IDEA
**************************
[url="http://www.diabetes.org/main/community/advocacy/type1.jsp"]http://www.diabetes.org/main/community/advocacy/type1.jsp[/url]
Article in this link:
"Your Child has Type 1 Diabetes"
mentions peanut butter several times.
*********************
Disclaimer: I do not guarantee the accuracy or content of the links in this post. I am not offering advice in any manner or form.
[This message has been edited by MommaBear (edited March 29, 2003).]

Posted on: Sat, 03/29/2003 - 2:01pm
MommaBear's picture
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Joined: 09/23/2002 - 09:00

Just for kicks.....
another interesting link:
[url="http://www.diabetes123.com/mendosa/nuts.htm"]http://www.diabetes123.com/mendosa/nuts.htm[/url]
Disclaimer: I do not guarantee the accuracy or content of the link in this post. I am not offering advice in any manner or form.

Posted on: Sun, 03/30/2003 - 12:00am
California Mom's picture
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Joined: 07/14/2000 - 09:00

My dh's cousin's little boy is diabetic. He is a darling little sweetheart, by the way. It just breaks my heart the way they have to control when, what, and how much he eats ALL THE TIME. Not to mention the needle sticks multiple times per day. It does make pa seem like a walk in the park, IMHO. Anyhow, I asked the mom about using soy bean butter instead of pb, at school. (They had issues at his preschool because of a "peanut free" policy.) She said that soy bean butter has too much sugar in it. Apparently, with pb it is the fat/protein ratio that is ideal when the little guy's sugar gets too low.
My long conversation with this mom gave me a lot of insight into the difficulties they encounter. My heart goes out to anyone whose child is afflicted with this condition. She actually told me of an incident regarding pb that pitted her son's "needs" against the "needs" of a pa child in his class. I'll share it if anyone is interested.
Cindy, I think you raised a marvelous question. I don't know if my "answer" is medically correct, but it is the information I was given. [img]http://uumor.pair.com/nutalle2/peanutallergy/smile.gif[/img] Miriam

Posted on: Sun, 03/30/2003 - 12:15am
mae's picture
mae
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Joined: 07/12/2002 - 09:00

Miriam - Thank you, Thank you, Thank you! I've been following this and waiting for a simple answer to Katiee's original question. Corvalis Mom and McKenzie's moms posts helped too.
But the fat/protein ration makes sense.
I, too, talked to a good friend who's daughter is diabetic - at length. She explained something similar to me.
I don't have time to check out all the links that have been posted - so thanks for taking the time to research it and put it into plain, simple words!
Thanks, too, Cindy for raising this seperately, so it doesn't get lost..
mae [img]http://uumor.pair.com/nutalle2/peanutallergy/wink.gif[/img]

Posted on: Sun, 03/30/2003 - 12:35am
river's picture
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Joined: 07/15/1999 - 09:00

When considering this topic be aware of the politics and $$$ behind it. The National Peanut Board does have a partner$hip with the American Diabetes Association and probably other diabetic organizations.

Posted on: Sun, 03/30/2003 - 1:05am
DebO's picture
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Joined: 03/15/1999 - 09:00

My son had a little girl who was diabetic in his class last year. She never brought peanut butter to school but instead brought egg sandwiches or hard boiled eggs to keep up her protein.
Maybe using peanut butter is more common in the States or depends on your family?
take care
deb

Posted on: Sun, 03/30/2003 - 2:07am
katiee's picture
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Joined: 05/09/2001 - 09:00

Wow, my computer was acting up yesterday and I have not been back in until now.
A BIG thank you to everyone, especially you Cindy for asking when I had given up, for posting some "real" answers to my original question.
That was all I wanted to know, there was no hidden agenda in my question. I really just wanted a real answer. I was not looking for a fight or a guilt trip because I did not agree with someone.
Just the facts ma'am [img]http://uumor.pair.com/nutalle2/peanutallergy/biggrin.gif[/img]
Katiee
[This message has been edited by katiee (edited March 30, 2003).]

Posted on: Sun, 03/30/2003 - 2:16am
MommaBear's picture
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Joined: 09/23/2002 - 09:00

What I didn't get was that if precautions were taken (some found in allergy management plans) to prevent cross contamination, possibly safer than the average child, would anyone have a problem with a diabetic child using a specific food for managing their diabetes? Would still having a problem with it indicate such measures to be ineffective?
Disclaimer: I am not offering advice in any manner or form.

Posted on: Sun, 03/30/2003 - 2:21am
MommaBear's picture
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Joined: 09/23/2002 - 09:00

mae,
you posted:
"I don't have time to check out all the links that have been posted "
sometimes I post links instead of excerpts as after reading some disclaimers on sites I am unsure if I can place quotes from the links in my posts. lol.

Posted on: Sun, 03/30/2003 - 2:56am
becca's picture
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Joined: 05/22/2001 - 09:00

I have no trouble with careful, supervised consumption of PB(regarding younger children), in a reasonably contained environment and with proper clean up. I especially have no porblem with a single child consuming it for a very valid medical reason in such a manner.
I would think an arrangement that is safe for all concerned could be arranged if there were both a diabetic child(ren) and PA child(ren) in the same school. I have recently been scouting out policies in our schools, and they actually vary by school. We have school choice and different systems of structure in each. In one school, the cafeteria is not peanut free, but the class with a PA child is and the entire class has assigned seats at lunch for the year. If there were a diabetic in the school or class, they could safely be at the other end of the table, or in another class.
From what I understand, anyway, the use of peanuts/peanut butter is likely not at a mealtime, but at a time when the child needs a "rescue". I would imagine a child is already with an adult or nurse and away from the class to have this care and snack. Seems safe to me. Again, as long as it is supervised and cleaned up.
This is just my personal feeling on how it could be handled if both a diabetic and PA child were needing such accomodations. becca

Posted on: Sun, 03/30/2003 - 3:21am
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Joined: 06/09/2001 - 09:00

This whole topic is very confusing to me, because some people are saying that peanut butter is a rescue food, and others are saying the opposite. Rescue foods for a diabetic are typically foods that can raise the blood sugar rapidly. Peanut butter would not fall into that category, since the amount of fat and protein in it would slow the digestion and the absorption of whatever sugars are in it. California Mom's post about her friend saying that soy butter has more sugar than peanut butter, and therefore not as appropriate for a diabetic would seem to confirm that peanut butter is not a rescue food. However, I've checked the nutritional info for Jif peanut butter versus IM Healthy soy butter, and this is what I found:
Peanut Butter: 16g fat, 7g carbohydrates, 3g sugar, 8g protein.
Soy Butter: 11g fat, 12g carbohydrates, 2g sugar, 7g protein.
So peanut butter has more sugar than soy butter, and the soy butter I have is sweetened with honey, so the unsweetened would have even less sugar. Soy butter has more total carbohydrates, but if they are not sugars, then they are complex carbohydrates that are not digested quickly like sugars are.
So, maybe I've been hanging around river too long, but sounds a little suspicious to me.

Posted on: Sun, 03/30/2003 - 4:58am
MommaBear's picture
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Joined: 09/23/2002 - 09:00

Kim M,
My personal impression is that we're talking [i] "management". [/i]
[url="http://www.foundation.csus.edu/dining/calendar/whatscooking.html"]http://www.foundation.csus.edu/dining/calendar/whatscooking.html[/url]
A quote from this link (found in the "food for thought" box :
[b] "The glucose in low glycemic index foods such as peanut butter, is digested more slowly, leading to a gradual increase in blood sugar.
For this reason, low glycemic index foods are recommended to help control both non-insulin- dependent and insulin- dependent diabetes." [/b]
MommaBear
Again, if the precautions are effective, why the fuss?
Disclaimer: I do not guarantee the accuracy or content of the link in this post. I am not offering advice in any manner or form.

Posted on: Sun, 03/30/2003 - 6:47am
becca's picture
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Joined: 05/22/2001 - 09:00

I correct my statement calling it rescue food. The point, then, is even better. It likely helps to avoid crisis, and the need for rescue.
None of us want our problem(whatever it is) to progress to crisis management if there can be prevention. It is unfortunate that one group's crisis is another's prevention. But I just do not feel one out ranks the other and if they co-exist, then in all fairness the best needs to be done to accomodate *both* the diabetic and PA child safely. becca

Posted on: Sun, 02/20/2005 - 12:34am
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Joined: 06/20/2001 - 09:00

I just wanted to clarify - to "rescue" someone from low blood sugar, you first need to give a fast acting sugar (like juice) to raise blood sugar, then give something slower acting (like carb/protein mix) to sustain the increase in blood sugar. Low blood sugar truly is a medical emergency and needs to be treated as seriously as peanut allergies (my son has both, so I can speak to medical emergency of both).

Posted on: Sun, 02/20/2005 - 3:39am
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Joined: 09/01/2000 - 09:00

I have type 1 diabetes and my daughter is allergic to peanuts and tree nuts. Our house is nut free. Low blood sugar is treated with something very sweet (glucose tablets, fruit juice, raisins, etc.) to raise the blood sugar level. A high protein snack then helps keep one's blood sugar stable. There is no reason that a high protein snack has to be peanut butter (it's just an easy one if allergies aren't a consideration). Cheese or milk, for example are excellent choices as well.
[This message has been edited by starrsdc (edited February 20, 2005).]

Posted on: Sun, 02/20/2005 - 5:19am
MommaBear's picture
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Joined: 09/23/2002 - 09:00

[url="http://herkules.oulu.fi/isbn9514256301/html/x209.html"]http://herkules.oulu.fi/isbn9514256301/html/x209.html[/url]
(taken from "Psychological features characterizing oral health behavior, diabetes self-care health status among IDDM patients:
Chapter 3. Review of literature"
scroll down to: "3.3.1. Diabetes self-care practices"
quote:
[i]"Concerning adherence to the prescribed diet, knowledge is needed, but social demands and personal preferences have been found to be play a major role, and simplification of the diet regimens has been recommended (Lo 1998). The most frequent barriers to dietary adherence are encountered at home, then come barriers at shopping for food and away from home (Glasgow et al. 1997)." [/i]
*******************************
[url="http://www.netce.com/course.asp?course=424"]http://www.netce.com/course.asp?course=424[/url]
Scroll down to "MEAL PLANNING" in the link in this post.
[i]"Nutrition therapy is one of the most challenging aspects of diabetes care. Diet-related issues are complex, requiring that the behavioral, functional, cognitive and socioeconomic aspects of the person be considered. In addition, cultural and religious customs play a significant role in a person's ability and desire to adhere to a recommended meal plan."[/i]
From: "Diabetes: Patient Teaching for Disease Management"
Disclaimer: I do not guarantee the accuracy, content, or currentness of the links in this post. I am not offering advice in any manner or form.

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