Other parents don\'t \"get it\"

Posted on: Sun, 11/19/2006 - 10:46pm
notnutty's picture
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I was picking my PA son up from school on Friday. I was sitting in the common area. Another parent came and sat next to me. I know this parent has a diabetic son from previous conversations. She said to me "when did they get the candy machine in here?". I hadn't noticed and I made a comment that I was not pleased because it is not part of the wellness policy and I was concerned about the peanut butter products being offered. I said "this is a peanut-safe school and I don't understand how the machine could fit into that category." She then proceeded to explain to me that "this is a peanut-safe school NOT peanut-free." I said I understood this because I have been working with school for almost a year to put accommodations in place for my son.

She then said "well, my son NEEDS to eat peanut butter to control his diabetes." I just explained to her that I am very familiar with diabetes because both of my parents are diabetic and they have been just fine having a peanut-free diet around my son. I also said that school is just 5 meals per week.

She got very angry at me and said that I am only interested in the safety of my son and I am not concerned with the needs of others. I said "well, yes, my son's safety is my main priority, just as she is concerned with her son."

I ended the conversation quickly when my son approached me.

I just don't get it. I don't know what this parent was arguing about. Peanut butter is allowed at lunch at the RED tables. All cold lunch and those children who want to visit the peanut butter cart sit at the RED tables. Her son is NOT prevented from eating peanut butter, yet she has to argue with me about the peanut-safe policy.

This is just more of a vent than anything else. I know that I need to contact the school to find out what happened with the vending machine. I guess I am just tired of people so concerned about themselves that they have little or no regard to the health and safety of other people. Even a parent who is dealing with her child's own health problems doesn't seem to get it.

VENT...VENT...VENT....

Donna

Posted on: Sun, 11/19/2006 - 11:41pm
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Quote:Originally posted by notnutty:
[b]I was picking my PA son up from school on Friday. I was sitting in the common area. Another parent came and sat next to me. I know this parent has a diabetic son from previous conversations. She said to me "when did they get the candy machine in here?". I hadn't noticed and I made a comment that I was not pleased because it is not part of the wellness policy and I was concerned about the peanut butter products being offered. I said "this is a peanut-safe school and I don't understand how the machine could fit into that category." She then proceeded to explain to me that "this is a peanut-safe school NOT peanut-free." I said I understood this because I have been working with school for almost a year to put accommodations in place for my son.
She then said "well, my son NEEDS to eat peanut butter to control his diabetes." I just explained to her that I am very familiar with diabetes because both of my parents are diabetic and they have been just fine having a peanut-free diet around my son. I also said that school is just 5 meals per week.
She got very angry at me and said that I am only interested in the safety of my son and I am not concerned with the needs of others. I said "well, yes, my son's safety is my main priority, just as she is concerned with her son."
I ended the conversation quickly when my son approached me.
I just don't get it. I don't know what this parent was arguing about. Peanut butter is allowed at lunch at the RED tables. All cold lunch and those children who want to visit the peanut butter cart sit at the RED tables. Her son is NOT prevented from eating peanut butter, yet she has to argue with me about the peanut-safe policy.
This is just more of a vent than anything else. I know that I need to contact the school to find out what happened with the vending machine. I guess I am just tired of people so concerned about themselves that they have little or no regard to the health and safety of other people. Even a parent who is dealing with her child's own health problems doesn't seem to get it.
VENT...VENT...VENT....
Donna[/b]
i couldn't help but think about this thread
[url="http://uumor.pair.com/nutalle2/peanutallergy/Forum1/HTML/003529.html"]http://uumor.pair.com/nutalle2/peanutallergy/Forum1/HTML/003529.html[/url]
and this post:
Quote:[b]An excerpt I found interesting:
Scroll down to "MEAL PLANNING" in the link in this post.
"Nutrition therapy is one of the most challenging aspects of diabetes care. Diet-related issues are complex, requiring that the behavioral, functional, cognitive and socioeconomic aspects of the person be considered. In addition, cultural and religious customs play a significant role in a person's ability and desire to adhere to a recommended meal plan."
From: "Diabetes: Patient Teaching for Disease Management"
Link to full article/course:
[url="http://www.netce.com/course.asp?course=424"]http://www.netce.com/course.asp?course=424[/url]
Maybe it is a question of defining "needs". Life-threatening ones. It's not always a question of weather metabolically PB is the best choice. Needs are not always metabolic. I *personally* believe that Life-Threatening Needs are not always metabolic either.
[/b]
General Disclaimer: I am not offering advice in any manner or form. I do not guarantee the accuracy, currentness, content, or applicability of the link in this post. IMMV.

Posted on: Mon, 11/20/2006 - 12:26am
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Mammabear: As always, I appreciate your comments. The point I was trying to make to this parent is that her son IS allowed to have PB for lunch. I have not pushed for a Peanut-free school. I have just tried to put policies into place to "reduce the risk." However, IF her son was not allowed PB for lunch, I strongly believe that his diabetes would still be controlled. I am comforatable with the lunch-room policies at this point and my son has not yet had a reaction while at school this year.
What irritates me is that I always try to consider the opposing viewpoint and try not to have blinders on when I consider a policy. The vending maching filled with peanut-products is not only against the school wellness policy (that has nothing to do with PA), but it also is a risk to my son. Who actually benefits from the vending machine??? Just the school administrators.
I really don't like the diabetic vs. pa argument. Both of these medical conditions pose very serious threats to the child's well-being. I would think that parents could work together to put policies in place that would benefit both types of conditions.
If this parent was not so argumentative, but would have listened to what I was trying to say she probably would have realized that "I AM ON HER SIDE!". I want all the children in the school to be safe and healthy...not just my son.
Donna
[This message has been edited by notnutty (edited November 20, 2006).]

Posted on: Mon, 11/20/2006 - 1:48am
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There was a thread here about a year ago about this very issue: do diabetics really have to have peanut butter and nothing else will sufice. Last year I had a lengthy conversation with a diabetic parent asking her about this. The way it came up was that her ds is diabetic and is one year ahead of my dd in school. I was checking out middle schools, her ds was in 6th grade in middle school, my dd was in 5th. I called her to ask about his middle school and how did things go with a 504--was the school willing to do it, did they give her a hard time, how was it with all the different teachers instead of just one teacher, etc. I was considering sending my dd to that middle school. So somehow this diabetic and peanut butter question came up and I asked her. Is there something specific to peanut butter that diabetics must have it? She said absolutely not and said that when someone is having a low blood sugar, in fact you would not want to give peanut butter. She said that peanut butter is a good source of protein, but it is not an immediate source of sugar. If someone`s sugar is too low, you want to give them a food or drink that will raise their sugar immediately and peanut butter does not do that. So she said that argument makes no sense that diabetics must eat peanut butter. She also commented that although peanut butter is a good source of protein, there are many other good sources of protein, there is no reason that a diabetic would need peanut butter for their protein as opposed to some other source.

Posted on: Mon, 11/20/2006 - 4:31am
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Carefulmom: Mamabear linked the discussion from a year ago in her post. Like I have said in my previous posts that although I believe that diabetics do not NEED peanut butter, it does not bother me if that is the personal choice they make. Maybe it helps regulate the blood sugar better for some people. That is what liberty is all about. I get it. However, if the pb is given in a environment in the school that affects other people (ie, vending machines open to everyone to eat from), that is when I have a problem. Right now every child has the choice whether or not to eat pb during lunch, it is located in a designated area.
Vending machines in an elementary school is not necessary for many reasons...of those reasons...pa, diabetics, obesity....I see this as not just a pa issue.
This mother was upset because she THOUGHT I wanted all pb eliminated from school. Although in a perfect world that would be wonderful, I know that my son does not live in a perfect world and this situation is working for us right now.
It annoys me that she used the "my son NEEDS pb argument" when we were discussing the vending machine. I will always believe that no one NEEDS pb. That is just a stupid statement that irritates me every time I hear it. I grew up in a diabetic household. Both my parents are diabetic...I never remember my mom stating....hurry get the peanut butter!!! My blood sugar is low!!! Orange juice or candy, but never pb.
I guess I am rambling again and still VENTING...VENTING...VENTING.....
Donna
[This message has been edited by notnutty (edited November 20, 2006).]

Posted on: Mon, 11/20/2006 - 4:45am
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My understanding is that PB is not used to raise the blood sugar in a diabetic, but to keep it from rising. The way I understand it (and I could be wrong) is the carbs and protein are a good balance, and it is metabolized slowly enough that it doesn't cause a quick rise in blood sugar. So it would be a good choice for a diabetic. But certainly not the only good choice. In fact, if it is on white bread, it could be a poor choice.

Posted on: Mon, 11/20/2006 - 5:05am
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I hear you. I understand that there are vending machines almost everywhere (though none at our schools thankfully). I'm not on a campaign to get rid of all vending machines. But vending machines at school are a different story IMO.
Quote:Originally posted by notnutty:
[b]However, if the pb is given in a environment in the school that affects other people (ie, vending machines open to everyone to eat from), that is when I have a problem.
Vending machines in an elementary school is not necessary for many reasons...of those reasons...pa, diabetics, obesity....I see this as not just a pa issue.
It annoys me that she used the "my son NEEDS pb argument" when we were discussing the vending machine. [/b]
Completely agree. I don't think vending machines are necessary [i]especially[/i] at school, as they promote snacking. <> That's just MY opinion.
If you have a child with a dietary need (FA, diabetes, picky eater, need of frequent snacks, etc.etc.) then you [i]know [/i]to plan ahead and bring your appropriate food.
Venting right there with you. I'd have a big problem if my schools had vending machines.

Posted on: Mon, 11/20/2006 - 5:41am
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People seem to be overlooking my point.
Lack of compliance, adherance, [i]interest[/i] in managing one's diabetes is, through evidence based research inextricably connected to a [i]poor outcome[/i] (translate: significant early death) in diabetics.
Diabetes is the fifth leading cause of death in the United States (pretty sure United States, not sure of the global picture). That's pretty significant. Hands down, pa doesn't even come close. I think it would behoove our community to have a little compassion, even when our intent in schools is misunderstood by the diabetic community. They have a lot on their plate. I wouldn't trade with them in a heartbeat. Never. Especially the parents. Too often I think as a community we get on this "but [i]our needs are imminently life threatening!!" not seeing the big picture for others. But that's just me. It's such a big picture, and blood sugars "in the range" aren't anywhere near the sole indicator that they are doing it right. (I personally believe glycosolated hemoglobin is a better indicator they are in the [i]ball park[/i], but again, it's just one aspect, there are so many aspects of health management to consider....I could be wrong)
But [b]compliance[/b]. Research (and common sense) has shown that [i]preference[/i].......CHOICE.......has a HUGE impact on [b]compliance[/b]. A KEY to surviving the disease. Or not dying any younger. Getting a shorter straw than you've been alloted. Quality of life. Sorry to sound dismal, but I can't argue with the documentation and statistics.
There but for the grace of God, right? No one is promised tommorrow, and I think pa is quite manageable. [i]I think multiple food allergies are quite manageable.[/i]
But that's just me.
Read the link. Please. Read, in particular:
>>>>>>>>Scroll down to [b]"MEAL PLANNING"[/b] in the link I posted earlier.
[i]"Nutrition therapy is one of the most challenging aspects of diabetes care. Diet-related issues are complex, requiring that the[b] behavioral, functional, cognitive and socioeconomic aspects[/b] of the person be considered. In addition, [b]cultural and religious customs[/b] play a significant role in a person's [b]ability[/b] and [b]desire[/b] to [b]adhere[/b] to a recommended meal plan."[/i]
desire, preference, wants....ARE inextricably linked to ADHERANCE.
[i]Compliance[/i].
If I were a parent of a diabetic child who expressed a [i]preference[/i] for a particular item that "worked" for their particular metabolism and diabetes (which can be highly individual and children tend to be "brittle diabetics"), I'd fight tooth and nail for it. And I'd have research to back it up, too.
pardon any spelling errors. sticking up for the other side is really demanding here. taxing.
a simple search of "preference compliance diabetes management outcome" etc.... probably will turn more than you could read in an afternoon or two related to the subject.
When it comes to a needs based comparison of pa and diabetes related to "life threatening" this just isn't a point I ethically can argue in my favor...

Posted on: Mon, 11/20/2006 - 5:42am
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GailW.
weren't you a "health educator" in a previous life?
Comments related to "compliance"?

Posted on: Mon, 11/20/2006 - 6:35am
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Mommabear: I am not trying to overlook your point. I understand what you are trying to say...I agree with you. If someone is going to comply with the diatary restrictions relating to diabetes, there must be a strong support system with MANY choices (including peanut butter if it does not cause harm to others).
If I had a choice to exchange PA for diabetes...NO WAY. I think diabetes is extremely hard to manage. However, we live in a society. We are not islands. What we do affects other people. What we eat in certain situations can affect other people.
I would be very supportive of any policy that would help any diabetic live a better, healthier life. Removing the vending machines could be a start.
I have also stated quite clearly that I am not asking the school to remove the pb from the lunch room. She just assumed that I would try to do that. I just don't think the vending machines are necessary...especially in an elementary school.
My point is that my son's health is JUST AS important and can be JUST AS difficult to mangage as any diabetic. I know, I have lived with both medical conditions most of my life.
I think if parents of diabetic children and parents of PA children could work together to create an environment that benefit both types of children. There are many things that we are both concerned about (holidays, birthday celebrations, etc...)
Donna

Posted on: Mon, 11/20/2006 - 7:21am
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You know, what strikes me about your conversation with her is that she seemed irritable and distracted (like she wasn't really hearing what you were saying, right?)...
I have to wonder why. Maybe she's had a rough few days/week managing with her child. We all have those weeks. Definitely not the time to push a particular FA button, right? Maybe you inadvertently pushed a button with her and it was kind of the last straw.
I think most of us have been there. Maybe look back on how we have handled conversations a bit badly because of being so exhausted and on-edge. Handling the blood-sugars of someone who is frighteningly brittle because of illness is truly as bad as anything PA parenting has to offer. There are times when those things can give you tunnel vision and all the social grace of a water buffalo at a Manhattan cocktail party.
I agree with MommaBear-- compassion.

Posted on: Mon, 11/20/2006 - 7:32am
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Okay. [b]Compliance. [/b]
Quote:Originally posted by notnutty:
[b]She said to me "when did they get the candy machine in here?" [/b]
MommaBear, how does the school adding a new [i]candy machine[/i]~ i.e. providing elementary school children and their parents candy choices~ have a positive impact on managing one's diabetes? In the immediate picture. or the Big picture.
Yes, I'll read the link. I'll try to get to it tonight.
Just making sure that we are addressing a [i]candy machine[/i] and diabetes. . .

Posted on: Mon, 11/20/2006 - 7:50am
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Ok. Read [i]most[/i] of it. This, in particular, caught my eye:
[i]"[b]Guidelines for the use of sugar. [/b]Although sugar used to be forbidden to those with diabetes, ADA guidelines for its use have been liberalized in recent years [42] . Current guidelines allow individuals with diabetes to occasionally substitute sugar- containing food for other carbohydrates as part of a balanced meal plan. The rules for sugar were relaxed because there is little scientific evidence to support the assumption that simple sugars aggravate hyperglycemia to a greater degree than starches. However, the ADA guidelines stipulate that sugar (in the form of sucrose) and sugar- containing foods may not simply be added to the meal plan but should be substituted for other carbohydrates gram for gram [41] . For example, the amount of carbohydrate in one ounce of chocolate (15 grams) may be substituted for the amount of carbohydrate in one serving of either starch (i.e., 1 slice of bread) or one serving of fruit (i.e., a small orange). Because most highly sugared foods are low in nutritional value and many are high in fat, it is recommended that they account for only a very small proportion of the diet."[/i]

Posted on: Mon, 11/20/2006 - 8:22am
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. . . and this, also from MB's link, following the general [b]Meal Planning [/b]section
[b]Case Study: Meal Planning [/b](for "patient C")
[i][b]Sugar. [/b]Guidelines for the use of sugar by people with diabetes have been discussed above. Patient C will need education and support in curtailing her high intake of sugar. She should be advised that sugar is not absolutely forbidden to her now that she has been diagnosed with diabetes. However, she will need to learn how to make choices about sugar as part of an overall plan for healthy eating. As part of her meal plan for diabetes, Patient C can occasionally substitute a serving of sugar for a serving of fruit, starch or milk. An example of an appropriate sugar substitution would be to have a 3-inch cookie in place of an orange. It should be recognized that the nutritional value of the cookie is greatly inferior to that of the orange, and therefore should only be an occasional substitution.[/b][/i]

Posted on: Mon, 11/20/2006 - 8:38am
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This is in response to the "why PB for diabetics" comment.
First, let me say I have no idea about that!!
What I *do* know is that last year my youngest was experiencing bouts of low blood sugar. His teacher recommended he eat more protein for breakfast to help hold him (his sugar levels) over 'til lunch. It did help. Turned out he was just going through a major growing spurt - he didn't have any lasting blood sugar problems.
ETA: We gave him 3 slices of bacon - not PB.
[This message has been edited by Lam (edited November 20, 2006).]

Posted on: Mon, 11/20/2006 - 10:44am
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Corvallis Mom: I think we were both having a bad day. Compassion is absolutely the right thing in this case. She is obviously dealing with a major health issue.
It sure does feel good to vent sometimes and then have others help point out strategies for dealing with these daily situations.
I will always try to keep her and other diabetic parents/children in mind as I try to deal with my son's PA.
Have a great night all!!!
Donna

Posted on: Mon, 11/20/2006 - 12:44pm
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Quote:Originally posted by Gail W:
[b]
MommaBear, how does the school adding a new [i]candy machine[/i]~ i.e. providing elementary school children and their parents candy choices~ have a positive impact on managing one's diabetes? In the immediate picture. or the Big picture.
Yes, I'll read the link. I'll try to get to it tonight.
Just making sure that we are addressing a [i]candy machine[/i] and diabetes. . . [/b]
I'm addressing an [i]undertone[/i]. It's allowed, right? I thought I was pretty obvious.
When I came here I encountered an [i]undertone[/i] regarding the diabetic community within [i]our community[/i]. And no one in my nuclear family is even diabetic. [img]http://uumor.pair.com/nutalle2/peanutallergy/smile.gif[/img]
It absolutely shames me as a member of the pa community.....and that's hard to do. We bristle everytime [i]diabetes[/i] or celiac, or another competing need comes up.
Why?
I think because we actually see them as having [i]valid needs[/i] that compete with our own.
Truth is, many of us don't want the vending machines.......[i]period[/i]. No matter what's put in them. Why? Is it because we rather not put the effort in to address what goes into them?
I think that *is* pretty selfish. You know, denying a [i]pleasure[/i] to someone else because we may not want to put the effort in.
But maybe that's not the reason. But I still ask "Why?".
Possibly it's a locus of control.
I think it really po's some of us that peanuts and nuts just might be a "healthy snack" for a great deal of people. That minus the candy and treats in the vending machines, there might not be much else that can replace that and still keep. That all of a sudden we aren't seen as being unblemished when demanding people change their eating habits for [i]our benefit[/i]. That yeah, maybe people *are* giving up something that might actually be of benefit to them.
My son get's his flavored water from the vending machine every day.
[i]Alone[/i].
Unless someone already understands the importance of this to me, I'm not bothering to explain. I'm also not going to pick apart the reasons why someone else might use a vending machine. No room here.
Funny story, but the day they asked me what was safe for him to drink from the vending machine, I asked them to purchase a flavored water with him while I waited in the office in order I might read the label. Would you believe the bottle dispensed didn't have a label? It had fallen off. Of all the bottles and offices in the world, that bottle dispenses into mine. [img]http://uumor.pair.com/nutalle2/peanutallergy/rolleyes.gif[/img]
Would you believe it?
Some days I actually depend on that vending machine to supply him with a [i]COOL!![/i] bottle of water (doesn't use public fountain per health portion of his IEP). I'm a bad mommy and don't always have two bottles of water for him to use. Or even a container to put tap water in. Call it a fault on my part, but [i]I'm just too busy, too overwhelmed right now to ensure I always have what my fifth grader might need while at school.[/i] Sure it's not life threatening, but it's going to be a cold day in **** when I start making my child request his aide get him tap water from a school faucet to drink. It's not necessary, and it's [i]totally inappropriate[/i] given the normal activity of daily living being able to purchase something as simple as a water from a vending machine is.
I'm also not going to keep a supply of water on hand in the nurse's office for him. [i]My son doesn't have to go to the nurse in order to drink water. [/i]Like he can't handle getting one from the vending machine. But I'm sure there's a lot I've already said that many here wouldn't bat an eye at requesting I add to his plate in the name of eliminating competing needs. But yeah, I'm a bad mommy, some mornings, I don't have a bottle of water to give him [i]and he [i]prefers[/i] to buy it from the vending machine rather than have me put it in a different container. So, I'm so *not* willing to take that away from him.
There's children who won't carry lifesaving medication because they [i]prefer[/i] not to, and parent's who back them up in that [i]choice[/i], so I question validity at times, when discussions centering around [i]preference[/i], or related topics, come up.
C'mon, we can't be the only community with [i]comfort zones[/i].
I could go on forever with a myriad of other things that would **** people off, especially since they take them for granted, but I'm not in the mood to explain myself any further. I still remember the "sensory" discussion and I remember it with [i]shame[/i], not for myself, but for others. Their attitudes.
But I'm addressing the [i]undertone[/i]. It's been pretty evident many of us don't cut the same slack to the same stresses (or greater ones) someone else might be experiencing that we complain bitterly about experiencing ourselves.
Compliance, adherance, diabetes, [i]preference.....choice[/i]. Availability, even. Please get back to me when you are done reading. Feel free to google. [img]http://uumor.pair.com/nutalle2/peanutallergy/smile.gif[/img]
and no, notnutty, I'm not referring to you in this post specifically, you just happen to bring up something that there has been discussions ad nauseaum about on this site. I'm just in a mood.

Posted on: Mon, 11/20/2006 - 1:03pm
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Quote:Originally posted by Lam:
[b]ETA: We gave him 3 slices of bacon - not PB.
[/b]
I'm pretty sure that wouldn't fall into the "wellness guidelines" for a vending machine in a school.....

Posted on: Mon, 11/20/2006 - 1:07pm
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Just saw your other posts gail. Not surprised at all [i]choice[/i]---[b]preference[/b] is something the ADA guidelines reflect...
Thanks.

Posted on: Mon, 11/20/2006 - 10:18pm
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From that same thread I posted a link to earlier:
[url="http://herkules.oulu.fi/isbn9514256301/html/x209.html"]http://herkules.oulu.fi/isbn9514256301/html/x209.html[/url]
(taken from "Psychological features characterizing oral health behavior, diabetes self-care health status among IDDM patients:
Chapter 3. Review of literature"
scroll down to: "3.3.1. Diabetes self-care practices"
a quote:
"Concerning [b]adherence[/b] to the prescribed diet, knowledge is needed, but [b]social[/b] demands and [b]personal preferences[/b] have been found to be play a major role, and [b]simplification[/b] of the diet regimens has been recommended (Lo 1998). The most frequent barriers to dietary [b]adherence[/b] are encountered at home, then come barriers at shopping for food and [b]away[/b] from home (Glasgow et al. 1997)."
The link mentioned items like: motivation, adherence, compliance, locus of control, preference. Sounds like something peanut butter could satisfy for a great deal of child diabetics.
And people ask [i]"do diabetics really have to have peanut butter (or nuts) and nothing else will suffice."[/i] Go figure.
Am I the only one comprehending what I'm reading?
And yeah, [i]simplification[/i] might translate to [b]availability[/b].
Disclaimer: I do not guarantee the accuracy, currentness, applicability, or content of the link in this post. I am not offering advice in any manner or form.

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 12:22am
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Maybe we should try to look at this through the eyes of both mothers.
They are both sitting there wishing their child did not have to face the challenges they face on a minute to minute basis. They are the same person actually.
It is not necessary for the mother of a diabetic child to try to get an upper hand in a conversation like this when the best thing to do would have been both mothers joining forces to commiserate, be a source of strength for each other and try to understand each others situation.
That comment "When did they get the candy machine in here?" is just perfect because it affects both mothers in different/the same ways.
Yesterday "Annie Hall" was on TV. Her psychiatrist asked Annie how was their s*x and she said "almost all the time, three times a week." Woody's psych asked him how was their s*x and he said "Hardly ever, three times a week."
Somehow this seems to fit.
Peggy

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 1:07am
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Quote:Originally posted by Peg541:
[b]Yesterday "Annie Hall" was on TV. Her psychiatrist asked Annie how was their s*x and she said "almost all the time, three times a week." Woody's psych asked him how was their s*x and he said "Hardly ever, three times a week."
[/b]
sex. [i]sex.[/i] [b]Sex.[/b] [img]http://uumor.pair.com/nutalle2/peanutallergy/biggrin.gif[/img]
heavy emphasis on the [b]"e".[/b] [img]http://uumor.pair.com/nutalle2/peanutallergy/wink.gif[/img]

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 1:09am
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Quote:Originally posted by Peg541:
[b]It is not necessary for the mother of a diabetic child to try to get an upper hand in a conversation like this[/b]
from what I'm reading, I don't think she tried to.
However, I constantly read comparisons between PA and numerous other conditions under the sun where pa parents are attempting to "get the upper hand".
[i]overwhelming sense of shame again....[/i]
That as a community, our needs [i]"trump"[/i] any others.

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 1:14am
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Just going to eek in here. With respect to diabetes and PA -- have a small comment. My Grandfather had diabetes, eventually ended up on dialysis. He was great. Miss him a lot. I certainly wouldn't deny him his food preferences, or what he would need to take care of himself. That said, just like DS has medical kits (benedry & epi) for times of emergency & reactions, my Grandfather prepared a small kit of sorts when he left his home.
I always remember when he and my Grandma drove up in front of the house, me and my Mom would be given the instructions about "here take this little box to the frig" (the little blue one had his insulin). Then "take this one, it has a sandwich" (like a small cooler bag with food in it) Plus a host of other instructions, with preferences along with necessities for his diabetes, that we went through in reverse order when they were leaving.
The point? My Grandfather had his own "kit" of sorts when he left his house, just like my DS. To say that a vending machine is necessary, or anything in it, just doesn't fly with me. A diabetic could have a "kit" of their own on their person. Just like those of us with children with PA, we are helping them to learn how to manage their own allergy. Many of us put 504's in place to make sure that people are trained, epipens accessible, plus a whole host of other accommodations. Why shouldn't the same be said for diabetics? Have the parents provide the specific, shelf stable, food items that their child would need in the event they have to have a quick jolt for their blood sugar. I think my Grandpa carried Lifesavors or some other small hard candy. Juice comes in those handy little boxes now.
Vending machines aren't a necessity. And neither is peanut butter.

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 2:16am
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Mamabear: I realize that your post was not directed specifically toward me. I am trying to understand BOTH points of view here. However, as I have stated previously, I have lived with 2 diabetic parents. I never remember them needing a vending machine close by for them to rely on to get a sugar boost. They take personal responsibility for their medical needs. I don't rely on the vending machine for my son's benedryl or epi...it is something I provide to him in case he needs it.
Your bottled water analogy is a little hard to swallow. Bottled water does not affect other people. Whereas, peanut M&Ms are not a good choice for this child to be eating around my son. This child should be carrying a sugar-boost with him at all times. A vending maching loaded with candy is not necessary in a elementary school. Period. It may be a convenience, a money-maker, etc....but I will never be convinced it is necessary.
I have a great deal of respect for any parent dealing with a medical condition. It is stressful and most of the time it just plain sucks. I have not made an attempt to remove peanut butter from the school...I only want it to be in a controlled environment. I need to reduce the risk to my son....this does not necessarily need to come at the expense of another child, but that is my job at a mother...advocate for MY son's well-being. This mother can advocate for her son's needs. My guess is that most of our needs can be met at the same time.
Diabetes is a very personal illness to me. I donated a kidney to my dad 3 years ago so he would not die from kidney failure related to his diabetes. That is why I would never opt for diabetes instead of PA. My dad and mom's house is peanut-free...that is a choice they have made. Peanut butter is not necessary...perhaps a choice.....a good choice....but not necessary.
I don't believe making that statement is anything other than a fact. I have always tried to "cut slack" to anyone who has a legitimate need and it can be explained to me. There are ways to work around competing needs. It is not black and white.
I think you just love to play devil's-advocate to see what type of reaction you can get out of people.
Donna

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 2:28am
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Quote:Originally posted by MommaBear:
[b] I'm pretty sure that wouldn't fall into the "wellness guidelines" for a vending machine in a school.....[/b]
Where would a "candy machine" fall in the wellness guidelines?
I understand your DC has access to a vending machine with bottled water. Do your DCs have access to candy machines at their school(s)?

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 2:32am
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Quote:Originally posted by MommaBear:
[b] I'm just in a mood.[/b]
What's up? Everything okay?

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 2:33am
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Quote:Originally posted by notnutty:
[b]
Diabetes is a very personal illness to me. I donated a kidney to my dad 3 years ago so he would not die from kidney failure related to his diabetes. That is why I would never opt for diabetes instead of PA. My dad and mom's house is peanut-free...that is a choice they have made. Peanut butter is not necessary...perhaps a choice.....a good choice....but not necessary.[/b]
the articles I quoted indicate otherwise. They indicate preference, choice, *are* a necessity.
Quote:[b]I think you just love to play devil's-advocate to see what type of reaction you can get out of people.
[/b]
you can think whatever you want. My postition on this has been [i]consistent[/i]. The same. For [i]years[/i].

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 2:38am
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Quote:Originally posted by Gail W:
[b] Where would a "candy machine" fall in the wellness guidelines?
I understand your DC has access to a vending machine with bottled water. Do your DCs have access to candy machines at their school(s)? [/b]
"candy machine" is a red herring. It's really about [i]vending machines[/i].
Honestly? I don't know if there are vending machines that dispense candy in my son's school. I do know the teacher gives butterfingers at the end of the day [i]to go home[/i] as rewards sometimes.... I've never demanded to inspect the school for candy machines. I do know, somewhere, there is a vending machine that dispenses water.
quite obviously the original conversation centered around pa vs. diabetes. Candy machine=red herring.

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 2:48am
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Quote:Originally posted by gvmom:
[b]I always remember when he and my Grandma drove up in front of the house, me and my Mom would be given the instructions about "here take this little box to the frig" (the little blue one had his insulin). Then "take this one, it has a sandwich" (like a small cooler bag with food in it) Plus a host of other instructions, with preferences along with necessities for his diabetes, that we went through in reverse order when they were leaving.
The point? My Grandfather had his own "kit" of sorts when he left his house, just like my DS. To say that a vending machine is necessary, or anything in it, just doesn't fly with me. A diabetic could have a "kit" of their own on their person. Just like those of us with children with PA, we are helping them to learn how to manage their own allergy. Many of us put 504's in place to make sure that people are trained, epipens accessible, plus a whole host of other accommodations. Why shouldn't the same be said for diabetics? Have the parents provide the specific, shelf stable, food items that their child would need in the event they have to have a quick jolt for their blood sugar. I think my Grandpa carried Lifesavors or some other small hard candy. Juice comes in those handy little boxes now. [/b]
How many times do I read about parents ****h and complaining their young adults/children are [i]non-compliant[/i] about wanting to carry an epipen? I think it's got a lot to do with [i]inconvienience[/i]. But time after time, I see parents finageling their way around this critical issue. Making excuses.
But here we go saying: "Diabetics should plan for every instance. Carry everything on their person or bring it away somewhere."
(when I could bring up current threads regarding parents and children complaining they have to "bring" their food with them to holiday events)
for shame, people.
Ever think a child learning to manage their diabetes with choices on hand, what's available, with some sense of [i]normalacy[/i] is important to compliance?
Do I have to make the connection between compliance, adherence, and good outcomes again?
But hey, it's not the vending machine [i]as much[/i] as it is about people trying to erradicate anything from it that doesn't suit their own personal needs. To me, the vending machine is just an extension of a lunch bag. Some people might see it the other way, but I've never demanded to limit what people can bring in their own lunch bag either....
Call it devil's advocacy, but my position on that is consistent. For [i]years[/i]
ie: "Peanut Free/Gun Free debate".
Quote:[b]Vending machines aren't a necessity. And neither is peanut butter.[/b]
You didn't read the articles did you?
edit d*** quotes.
[This message has been edited by MommaBear (edited November 21, 2006).]
[This message has been edited by MommaBear (edited November 21, 2006).]

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 2:53am
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Quote:Originally posted by notnutty:
[b]Your bottled water analogy is a little hard to swallow. Bottled water does not affect other people. Whereas, peanut M&Ms are not a good choice for this child to be eating around my son. This child should be carrying a sugar-boost with him at all times. [/b]
and a lot of people should be carrying an epipen around with them at all times too. [i]On their person[/i]. Your point?
Wait, are we saying only pa individuals need a sense of "normalacy"??

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 2:53am
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Quote:Originally posted by MommaBear:
[b] the articles I quoted indicate otherwise. They indicate preference, choice, *are* a necessity
[/b]
Articles vs. real life....perhaps that is the distinction I am trying to make. This illness has always been part of my life. I could probably find an "article" that says otherwise "pb is not necessary". Obviously all of us need choices. But we always have to remember that our "choices" affect other people. Not just when it comes to food.
BTW...I did not need inspect the school for a vending machine. The school made sure to put it right where all the kids and parents had access to it. It is not hidden in some corner, but in the main gathering commons.
I am done with responding to this thread....it started out as a vent from one PA parent to another (I thought that was the purpose of this board??!)...obviously it has turned into something more than I intended.
Donna

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 2:54am
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Let me use a different analogy- one which will probably make more sense to our community. Is carrying epinephrine and reading labels a "choice"? Oh, sure it is... it's a choice we don't ever want our kids thinking of [i]not[/i] making. All of us go out of our way to make carrying epinephrine and eating safely as easy and FUN to comply with as possible.
So-- appropriate diabetes management also involves dozens of little choices just like that. Making the wrong ones doesn't (usually) cost these kids their lives [i]right then[/i] the way our kids' poor choices can-- but it can cost them their lives nonetheless, if they don't learn to own their diabetes. Diabetic kids often have a luxury our kids don't-- they can 'cheat' about management. At least for a while-- it catches up to them eventually. Maybe not such a nice thing not to have immediate consequences, eh?
How would you like other parents complaining that your child shouldn't be using a particular epipen carrier or med bag because it was a distraction to their own ADHD child in a classroom? What if that meant risking that your child would hate the alternative (and likely be non-compliant as a result)?
Diabetic kids need to feel that they have control of their diabetes-- not that it controls THEM. Choosing foods they love is critical-- because they get [i]few[/i] choices about [i]when[/i] to eat or how much. (And peanut butter IS a great choice for them-- in moderation.) Parents dealing with diabetes quite naturally bristle when they think that another parent might try to undermine that effort.

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 2:59am
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Quote:Originally posted by Corvallis Mom:
[b]Let me use a different analogy- one which will probably make more sense to our community. Is carrying epinephrine and reading labels a "choice"? Oh, sure it is... it's a choice we don't ever want our kids thinking of [i]not[/i] making. All of us go out of our way to make carrying epinephrine and eating safely as easy and FUN to comply with as possible.
So-- appropriate diabetes management also involves dozens of little choices just like that. Making the wrong ones doesn't (usually) cost these kids their lives [i]right then[/i] the way our kids' poor choices can-- but it can cost them their lives nonetheless, if they don't learn to own their diabetes. Diabetic kids often have a luxury our kids don't-- they can 'cheat' about management. At least for a while-- it catches up to them eventually. Maybe not such a nice thing not to have immediate consequences, eh?
How would you like other parents complaining that your child shouldn't be using a particular epipen carrier or med bag because it was a distraction to their own ADHD child in a classroom? What if that meant risking that your child would hate the alternative (and likely be non-compliant as a result)?
Diabetic kids need to feel that they have control of their diabetes-- not that it controls THEM. Choosing foods they love is critical-- because they get [i]few[/i] choices about [i]when[/i] to eat or how much. (And peanut butter IS a great choice for them-- in moderation.) Parents dealing with diabetes quite naturally bristle when they think that another parent might try to undermine that effort.[/b]
I [i]love[/i] you. And I'm not even a parent of a diabetic child. But I am a parent of two children on the autism spectrum. Officially, now.

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 3:01am
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Quote:Originally posted by gvmom:
[b] Many of us put 504's in place to make sure that people are trained, epipens accessible, plus a whole host of other accommodations. Why shouldn't the same be said for diabetics? Have the parents provide the specific, shelf stable, food items that their child would need in the event they have to have a quick jolt for their blood sugar.
[/b]
I was subbing in a class a month or so ago. There was a brittle diabetic in the class (I posted about the note the teacher left me that day in another thread). The boy goes to the nurse to have his blood sugar checked 3-4 times a day, and if not feeling well goes immediately (accompanied by a friend). He has a stash of snacks in the nurse's office, all labeled so the nurse can determine what suits his needs at the moment. I don't know whether this child has a 504, but he certainly has staff that are trained in his needs, and all the supplies he needs for his own condition. Just like many of our children.
Of course, I have always been very happy with how our schools handle PA, so it's no surprise to me that they would handle diabetes well. Perhaps another school wouldn't.

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 3:10am
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Quote:Originally posted by Jimmy's mom:
[b] I was subbing in a class a month or so ago. There was a brittle diabetic in the class (I posted about the note the teacher left me that day in another thread). The boy goes to the nurse to have his blood sugar checked 3-4 times a day, and if not feeling well goes immediately (accompanied by a friend). He has a stash of snacks in the nurse's office, all labeled so the nurse can determine what suits his needs at the moment. I don't know whether this child has a 504, but he certainly has staff that are trained in his needs, and all the supplies he needs for his own condition. Just like many of our children.
[/b]
how old is he?

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 3:15am
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Quote:Originally posted by Corvallis Mom:
[b]Diabetic kids need to feel that they have control of their diabetes-- not that it controls THEM. Choosing foods they love is critical-- because they get [i]few[/i] choices about [i]when[/i] to eat or how much. (And peanut butter IS a great choice for them-- in moderation.) Parents dealing with diabetes quite naturally bristle when they think that another parent might try to undermine that effort.[/b]
I get/got that.
I just don't think that [i]vending machines[/i] are an appropriate in schools, especially elementary school. Convenience and accessibility are both a positive [i]and a negative. [/i]

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 3:17am
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Quote:Originally posted by Gail W:
[b]
I just don't think that [i]vending machines[/i] are an appropriate in schools, especially elementary school. Convenience and accessibility are both a positive [i]and a negative. [/i] [/b]
that's real life, now, isn't it?
[b]Risk/Benefit[/b]

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 3:18am
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Quote:Originally posted by notnutty:
[b]
Articles vs. real life....perhaps that is the distinction I am trying to make. [/b]
Those articles/research [b]are[/b] based on [i]real life[/i].

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 3:20am
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Quote:Originally posted by notnutty:
[b]
I am done with responding to this thread....it started out as a vent from one PA parent to another (I thought that was the purpose of this board??!)...obviously it has turned into something more than I intended.
[/b]
actually, I don't think the purpose of this board is soley that. At least IMHPO. It's just a fringe benefit. Sometimes.

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 3:49am
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Maybe it's just me. *I* don't want my child/children having convenient accessibility to vending machines at school. I can only presume that if I were the mother of a diabetic child, I would feel the same. Maybe even more so. [i]Maybe I'm wrong MB.[/i]
IMO, I don't want my child, especially my young elementary age child, having unsupervised access, [i]convenient [/i]access, to a machine that dispenses food.
I like it the way we have it at our district: in general, if a child wants or needs food, the student goes to the cafeteria. [i]That's how all the kids do it.[/i] There is a [i]person[/i] who knows my child's needs and who can [i]assist[/i] her, (and if necessary *monitor* her) with her choices. If the person in the cafeteria needs help remembering my child's needs, they swipe her ID card and it 'reminds' them about her food needs. Purchases are [i]documented[/i] on her id card. I can have a print out any time.
I would not have all those benefits with a vending machine.
Maybe 'vending machines' are considered a plus for some. I just think that there are better ways to have convenient accessibility.

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 5:26am
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Quote:Originally posted by Gail W:
[b]
IMO, I don't want my child, especially my young elementary age child, having unsupervised access, [i]convenient [/i]access, to a machine that dispenses food. [/b]
[i]middle school child[/i].
Quote:[b]I like it the way we have it at our district: in general, if a child wants or needs food, the student goes to the cafeteria. [i]That's how all the kids do it.[/i] There is a [i]person[/i] who knows my child's needs and who can [i]assist[/i] her, (and if necessary *monitor* her) with her choices. If the person in the cafeteria needs help remembering my child's needs, they swipe her ID card and it 'reminds' them about her food needs. Purchases are [i]documented[/i] on her id card. I can have a print out any time.
I would not have all those benefits with a vending machine.
Maybe 'vending machines' are considered a plus for some. I just think that there are better ways to have convenient accessibility.
[/b]
[i]Sweet[/i].
a full service cafeteria with electronic documentation might be a way for [i]some[/i] but not all. Most schools don't even offer hot items. Let alone a [i]full service cafeteria[/i] catered by [i]Chartwell's[/i]. I hear they do "diabetic" menus.
I had to pick my child up early from school today.....again, as a school nurse wasn't available in the afternoon. I should be relieved, since for the greater part [i]forced absenteeism[/i] has been due to the lack of an aide. My district isn't short on funds, just [i]planning[/i]....postitions remain [i]unfilled[/i].
Count yourself among the lucky ones, but don't assume every one has the access, financial resources, or ability to get that type of situation. You know, dear Gail, [i]it isn't[/i] because I don't know my opponent, my rights, or [i]my job[/i]. Or theirs.
It would be wonderful to be able to afford a lawyer. (evil, evil, maleficient grin--I think I just felt two horns pop out of my head.)
I'd say it would be wonderful to move, but that's no guarantee, either. I'm not counting on finding any better situation...
Tomorrow I was told to keep him home because of the school wide "buffet".
This is reality for the majority of us, Gail.

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 5:37am
Gail W's picture
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Quote:Originally posted by MommaBear:
[b] that's real life, now, isn't it?
[b]Risk/Benefit[/b]
[/b]
Indeed.
I wonder what parents of diabetic children would think about the risk/benefit of their child having unmonitored access to foods. . . many of those foods being [i]sugary[/i].

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 5:43am
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[b]But here we go saying: "Diabetics should plan for every instance. Carry everything on their person or bring it away somewhere." [/b]
I would say that. Of course, I say the same thing for dealing with my son

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 6:08am
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Quote:Originally posted by MommaBear:
[b] I hear they do "diabetic" menus. [/b]
Yep. And they're economical, too. It's [i]cheaper[/i] for my dd's to purchase lunch than for me to send. (BTW, they also offer classroom party cupcakes safe for those with specific allergies.)
Quote:Originally posted by MommaBear:
[b] Count yourself among the lucky ones, but don't assume every one has the access, financial resources, or ability to get that type of situation. [/b]
I agree that I'm lucky. Absolutely.
However, I don't think I made any assumptions. I don't know the situation at notnutty's school. May be the same, better, different or worse than mine. Unlike vending machines in other environments, I believe vending machines in schools can pose serious problems. Not saying these are insurmountable, but children having unsupervised access to food is troublesome to me. I oppose it. <> At the elementary school as well as at Middle School. No vending machines are in our High School either. I'm [i]glad[/i]. I'm expressing why I wouldn't want "vending machines" in my schools. I'm allowed, right? [img]http://uumor.pair.com/nutalle2/peanutallergy/wink.gif[/img]
Quote:Originally posted by MommaBear:
[b]I'd say it would be wonderful to move, but that's no guarantee, either. I'm not counting on finding any better situation...[/b]
I still have that dance CD waiting in my van. [img]http://uumor.pair.com/nutalle2/peanutallergy/smile.gif[/img]
Quote:Originally posted by MommaBear:
[b]Tomorrow I was told to keep him home because of the school wide "buffet".
This is reality for the majority of us, Gail.[/b]
[b]? ? ? [/b]
Hmmm. . . You're setting me apart? Why? Why do you believe that 'my reality' is different from yours ?
[This message has been edited by Gail W (edited November 21, 2006).]

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 6:25am
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Quote:[b]But hey, it's not the vending machine as much as it is about people trying to erradicate anything from it that doesn't suit their own personal needs. To me, the vending machine is just an extension of a lunch bag. Some people might see it the other way, but I've never demanded to limit what people can bring in their own lunch bag either....[/b]
[i]Same[/i]: I've never demanded to limit what students can bring in their own lunch bag either. [img]http://uumor.pair.com/nutalle2/peanutallergy/smile.gif[/img]
But I don't see vending machines as an extension of a lunch bag. No way. When my elementary daughter *and/or* my Middle School daughter eat from their lunch bag, there is a level of [i]monitoring. [/i]

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 6:58am
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Quote:Originally posted by Gail W:
[b] Indeed.
I wonder what parents of diabetic children would think about the risk/benefit of their child having unmonitored access to foods. . . many of those foods being [i]sugary[/i].[/b]
see, you keep redirecting the conversation back to a point I'm not making. Flash bang, you know?
I think I've made it clear I'm sick of the undertone. [i]And the tunnel vision[/i]. You know, "Pa trumps diabetes". Trying to making parents of whatever other competing need look like complete jerks. Disgusts me.
They're out there fighting the same fight we are and for the greater part, I keep hearing stuff like this:
[i]"I guess I am just tired of people so concerned about themselves that they have little or no regard to the health and safety of other people. Even a parent who is dealing with her child's own health problems doesn't seem to get it."[/i]
when it's so obvious from it [i]it works both ways[/i]. That two way street you used to talk about.
Anywhoooo.
When's the last time you let another parent at school without a pa child dictate to you how to manage your own child's pa needs?
Or say: "I had a relative with pa and [i]they did it differently, did this, managed this way, etc....so you should too."?
Because it sure looks like we have some of that going on here and they won't even bother to read literature to [i]educate themselves[/i].
You know, things we try to do each day as parents ourselves related to our child's allergy needs.
Disgusts me, I tell ya.

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 7:03am
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Quote:Originally posted by Gail W:
[b] [i]Same[/i]: I've never demanded to limit what students can bring in their own lunch bag either. [img]http://uumor.pair.com/nutalle2/peanutallergy/smile.gif[/img]
But I don't see vending machines as an extension of a lunch bag. No way. When my elementary daughter *and/or* my Middle School daughter eat from their lunch bag, there is a level of [i]monitoring. [/i][/b]
In what way? Lunch bag inspection? I never asked for that either. I've [i]requested that Steven be allowed to remove himself and/or use the seat reserved at the peer lunch table for him.[/i] (one side, end seat.) He's doing a fine job of it. You know, if he was the type to be offended by something like that or expect his needs to be point blank center of whatever is going on.....I'd never see the end of similiar issues. But he's pretty understanding of his fellow man...peers, cheerleaders. [img]http://uumor.pair.com/nutalle2/peanutallergy/biggrin.gif[/img]

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 7:31am
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Quote:Originally posted by MommaBear:
[b] They're out there fighting the same fight we are and for the greater part, I keep hearing stuff like this:
[i]"I guess I am just tired of people so concerned about themselves that they have little or no regard to the health and safety of other people. Even a parent who is dealing with her child's own health problems doesn't seem to get it."[/i]......
Disgusts me, I tell ya.
[/b]
MB....I did excuse myself from this conversation, but since you decided to quote me, I thought I needed to explain.
This parent is absolutely doing what she feels is best for her son. I have not even asked the school to remove the pb from the lunchroom. Her son CAN have as much PB as he needs, he just needs to sit in the designated place. I have always been considerate about other people's medical conditions. But it does p*ss me off that another parent, who is also dealing with a medical condition, cannot ALSO take off the blinders and look at how eating PB candy from a vending machine where ever her child choses, is wrong.
That is what disgusts me.
Donna

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 7:47am
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Quote:Originally posted by notnutty:
[b] MB....I did excuse myself from this conversation, but since you decided to quote me, I thought I needed to explain.
This parent is absolutely doing what she feels is best for her son. I have not even asked the school to remove the pb from the lunchroom. Her son CAN have as much PB as he needs, he just needs to sit in the designated place. I have always been considerate about other people's medical conditions. But it does p*ss me off that another parent, who is also dealing with a medical condition, cannot ALSO take off the blinders and look at how eating PB candy from a vending machine where ever her child choses, is wrong.
That is what disgusts me.
Donna[/b]
huh? you left out [b]six paragraphs[/b] in your [i]liberal edit[/i]. Changes the whole meaning. What's up with that?
You are quoting me incorrectly....editing out vital paragraphs before the "disgusts me part". Why, I can only guess.
But this thread isn't about "candy vending machines". It's about the title:
[b]"Other parents don't 'get it'"[/b]
the [i]irony[/i] strikes me.

Posted on: Tue, 11/21/2006 - 8:00am
Gail W's picture
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Joined: 12/06/2001 - 09:00

It was about 'candy/vending machines' for me.
Quote:[b]see, you keep redirecting the conversation back to a point I'm not making. Flash bang, you know?[/b]
[img]http://uumor.pair.com/nutalle2/peanutallergy/rolleyes.gif[/img] [i][b] Uhhhh. . . It's a point *I* want to make. [/i][/b] That's allowed, right? LOL!
I think it's valid to reject 'vending machines' in general based on lack of supervision. I think food consumption requires some monitoring. Regardless of [i]any [/i]one [/i]particular health need. That's my opinion.
Quote:Originally posted by MommaBear:
[b] In what way? Lunch bag inspection? I never asked for that either. I've [i]requested that be allowed to remove himself . . . [/i] He's doing a fine job of it. [/b]
No lunch bag inspection. You can substitute Mariah's name in your post. Her friends eat PB at the same table (since 4th grade).
By monitoring I mean that there are lunch monitors in the cafeteria who are specifically trained in FAs. The school counselor is one. She is the case manager of Mariah's 504 and is in the cafeteria when Mariah eats. She makes sure that the table was properly cleaned prior to Mariah's lunch period, and if a table friend brings in a celebratory food to share, makes sure that the student/parent has complied with the school's [i]policy[/i] that it contains an ingredient label. Mariah is LD in reading, and sometimes she needs help with the ingredient label and so the counselor is there to make sure Mariah has successfully determined whether or not the communal food is safe for her to eat.
[b]When's the last time you let another parent at school without a pa child dictate to you how to manage your own child's pa needs?[/b]
Actually, I don't think it matters even if the parent does or does not have a PA child. I don't think any other parent has 'dictated' anything re my child. However, I've made 'concessions' (if you want to call them that), regarding the needs of others, including students who have added [i]academic[/i] needs eating their PB lunches in classrooms for tutoring, and students with diabetes eating PB crackers in the nurses office. [i] Is that what you mean by "letting another parent dictate"? [/i]
[This message has been edited by Gail W (edited November 21, 2006).]

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